tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post114416416828515924..comments2023-11-03T06:35:48.003-05:00Comments on Shark and Shepherd: Religious discrimination by the state of WisconsinRick Esenberghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07280070509167910367noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-1144460845295300862006-04-07T20:47:00.000-05:002006-04-07T20:47:00.000-05:00ToddThe Colorado law has everything to do with ben...Todd<BR/><BR/>The Colorado law has everything to do with benefits. As I understand it, it allows people to enter into reciprocal benefit agreements that will have some immediate legal consequences and then can be recognized (or not)by employers who wish to extend health insurance and other benefits to those who enter into such agreements. I understand that the "or not" will be objected to by some, but it really does get us to what the legal situation is in most places. Employers are not required to extend benefits to same sex couples, but are free to do so.Rick Esenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07280070509167910367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-1144330716576482002006-04-06T08:38:00.000-05:002006-04-06T08:38:00.000-05:00Rick,I agree with you. Self selection by employees...Rick,<BR/><BR/>I agree with you. Self selection by employees of political and religious organizations will lead to optimal results for all involved. There are all kinds of legally viable ways to determine an appropriate new hire without relying on blanket discrimination against all non-Christians or all Mexican-Americans or what have you. That's why there's no reason for a nonprofit not to adhere to formal nondiscrimination criteria and thereby qualify to participate in the program.<BR/><BR/>Re. ADF, I don't understand your reasoning. What does Glen Lavy's support for the Colorado proposal (which has nothing to do with benefits) have to do with whether or not he'll sue the cities of Madison and Milwaukee for their domestic partnership programs? It should be noted that he's involved (as amicus) in a suit attempting to deny d.p. programs to all public employees in Michigan and that he's suing Miami University in Ohio because of its d.p. program. His reason? Those programs create a "legal status" substantially similar to marriage, which in Ohio and Michigan is now unconstitutional. I know this because I've read ADF's press releases.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-1144286513416915202006-04-05T20:21:00.000-05:002006-04-05T20:21:00.000-05:00Todd, a pro-abortion rights group could presumably...Todd, a pro-abortion rights group could presumably require that a person be committed to abortion rights because that would not constitute religious discrimination, but political discrimination which isn't prohibited.<BR/><BR/>This "anti-discrimination" business is a ruse to deny equal access to groups with a disfavored position. It is extremely unlikely that any gay person will want to work for the Christian Legal Society, just like no pro-lifer is going to want a job at NARAL.<BR/><BR/>As for ADF, you could be right except that the head of its marriage project has endorsed Colorado's reciprocal benefits law. While I appreciate that such a law is unacceptable to advocates of same sex marriage for a variety of reasons, it would proabably protect existing health benefits which are extended by those employers who want to extend them.Rick Esenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07280070509167910367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-1144241943462741872006-04-05T07:59:00.000-05:002006-04-05T07:59:00.000-05:00It's not religious discrimination because it appli...It's not religious discrimination because it applies evenly across the board--including to those who would discriminate based on religion in their hiring decisions: i.e. a pro-abortion rights group must abide by the state's nondiscrimination statutes in the same way that an anti-abortion rights group must; a Jewish social services group must adhere to the same nondiscrimination criteria that a Catholic social service group adheres to. <BR/><BR/>The current process for deciding what groups qualify for the employee giving program applies the same test to every single group across the board, and groups that demand an exception in order to discriminate are asking for uneven and unfair treatment. <BR/><BR/>That ADF is involved in interesting. Their increased presence in Wisconsin is further proof that they're planning to strip gay families of existing health care if the civil unions and marriage ban becomes part of our constitution.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-1144199824944596452006-04-04T20:17:00.000-05:002006-04-04T20:17:00.000-05:00ToddADF is involved but to say that this is "discr...Todd<BR/><BR/>ADF is involved but to say that this is "discrimination" doesn't help us. Id "discrimination" is the touchstone, why isn't this discrimination on the basis of creed? You can participate as long as we don't disapprove of your beliefs.Rick Esenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07280070509167910367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-1144197451413453462006-04-04T19:37:00.000-05:002006-04-04T19:37:00.000-05:00If the nondiscrimination signed into law in 1982 b...If the nondiscrimination signed into law in 1982 by Lee Dreyfus (R) means anything, shouldn't it mean that the state cannot condone or support or sponsor discrimination?<BR/><BR/>This smells like the Alliance Defense Fund? Are they involved?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-1144167862352422552006-04-04T11:24:00.000-05:002006-04-04T11:24:00.000-05:00That's a little better, then.That's a little better, then.Billiamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15489132492383133253noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-1144166167348109022006-04-04T10:56:00.000-05:002006-04-04T10:56:00.000-05:00It is, thankfully, in federal court.It is, thankfully, in federal court.Rick Esenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07280070509167910367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-1144164437196626062006-04-04T10:27:00.000-05:002006-04-04T10:27:00.000-05:00But, with our State Supreme Court make up, what ar...But, with our State Supreme Court make up, what are the odds?Billiamhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15489132492383133253noreply@blogger.com