tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post3532554001545527865..comments2023-11-03T06:35:48.003-05:00Comments on Shark and Shepherd: Beyond PolitiFactRick Esenberghttp://www.blogger.com/profile/07280070509167910367noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-69100572824055314682011-12-18T20:26:40.147-06:002011-12-18T20:26:40.147-06:00Lying Garage infests another site.Lying Garage infests another site.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17333132048552751053noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-74396020188772105642011-12-18T19:23:49.985-06:002011-12-18T19:23:49.985-06:00"For a variety of reasons, stemming from tech..."For a variety of reasons, stemming from technological changes,we are, whether we like it or not, headed toward a journalism that is more democratic and competitive than credentialed and authoritative."<br /><br />This is rich. What we have today emerging on the right is a series of megaphone-owners who each parrot what the other says, with no or little apparent regard for the truth. <br /><br />The ladies on the North Avenue Bridge aren't old enough to sign the recall papers! The video goes viral. Chuckles Sykes, Mark Belling, the MacIver Institute, Media Trackers, and the other non-journalistic wingnut sychophants all rebroadcast and cite each other. <br /><br />The story turns out to be totally false. Does the real story ever come out in the right-wing trash press? Of course not as the "journalists" move on to the next non- pseudo-story.<br /><br />This is progress?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-62310369851965638872011-12-18T11:15:54.366-06:002011-12-18T11:15:54.366-06:00I would love to see a Politifact type lie analysis...I would love to see a Politifact type lie analysis filter in real time. So when Reince Priebus says "Wisconsin is literally riddled with voter fraud", his words would be replaced with dead air silence. <br /><br />Was Priebus lying or just stupid when he said that? And which is worse? One thing is for sure, Walker and WIGOP do not trust Wisconsin citizens.garage mahalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06485491995866513686noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-31920595677966493392011-12-16T12:42:43.486-06:002011-12-16T12:42:43.486-06:00Dad29, you can be remarkably relativist and non-ab...Dad29, you can be remarkably relativist and non-absolutist when it suits you. It's almost like you don't think it is possible that anyone could or should strive to be objective and determine whether a statement was true or false.Display Namehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15842340986220388709noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-80491941994729190642011-12-16T09:31:58.298-06:002011-12-16T09:31:58.298-06:00Following on George's remark, another pundit h...Following on George's remark, another pundit has suggested that Politifact (and the AP "fact check" cousin) are merely instruments used by the MSM to regain its former place as the Dispenser of All News.<br /><br />IOW, it's a rear-guard op.<br /><br />It's also far too late.Dad29https://www.blogger.com/profile/08554276286736923821noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-91155119696321975052011-12-16T08:23:07.305-06:002011-12-16T08:23:07.305-06:00On the plus side, Politifact often provides helpfu...On the plus side, Politifact often provides helpful in-depth analysis. Some of the regular reporters (Borowski, Umhoefer, et.al) are competent.<br /><br />The rating system is dumb. Supposedly, the MJS must abide by it as a requirement of being part of the Politifact family.<br /><br />While purporting to be objective and thorough, Politifact exempts one institution from scrutiny. Namely, the Journal Sentinel. Thus, highly subjective assertions and selective omissions by the news staff are off limits for Politifact. This is consistent with the culture in most traditional newsrooms, where the admission of error is largely verboten.George Mitchellnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-10776888213437208192011-12-15T20:40:39.681-06:002011-12-15T20:40:39.681-06:00I guess I missed the negative tone in the profile ...I guess I missed the negative tone in the profile of OneWisconsinNow.<br /><br />I am not persuaded that MacIver, Media Trackers and the Wisconsin Reporter are less accurate than older media outlets. I will say that, at least with respect to the latter two, there is a a clear editorial policy but at least that policy is clear. <br /><br />For a variety of reasons, stemming from technological changes,we are, whether we like it or not, headed toward a journalism that is more democratic and competitive than credentialed and authoritative. <br /><br />If things like PolitFact want to push back against that, they are going to have do better.<br /><br />Anon 6:19<br /><br />I am not interested in arguing about who "lie/distorts/fantazizes/deludes" more and I have no idea who "you people" are supposed to be. <br /><br />I think there are people on the left and right who have credibility notwithstanding their perspectives. There are others who don't. I'd rather focus on the speaker that what side they are on.Rick Esenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07280070509167910367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-2298642589205124282011-12-15T19:39:36.412-06:002011-12-15T19:39:36.412-06:00Perhaps some right-wing Daddy Warbucks should fund...Perhaps some right-wing Daddy Warbucks should fund the development of a handful of media oversight organizations. <br /><br />Oh, wait. They did. That hasn't turned out so well, as those organizations have recently and repeatedly demonstrated themselves to be far more slipshod than the newspapers. I guess that's why you're not suggesting that Media Trackers or McGuyver or WPRI is doing a better job of attempting to even-handedly exposed the distortions of the right and the left.<br /><br />But back in the day at the Badger Herald, we kept Tom Kertscher on the sports beat. Now he's worked his way up to Politifact.<br /><br /><a href="http://mediatrackers.org/2011/01/895000-in-soros-money-funds-wisconsin-organizations/" rel="nofollow">Media Trackers</a> did try to disparage WisconsinWatch by linking them to George Soros (and therefore the Nazis, they said) for having received funds for a budget analysis project. Can anyone imagine Media Trackers / Wisconsin Reporter / McGuyver / WPRI publishing anything (article or commentary) that would cast a negative light on a major Republican organization, in the same way <a href="http://www.wisconsinwatch.org/2011/12/07/one-wisconsin-now-watchdog-or-attack-dog/" rel="nofollow">WisconsinWatch</a> criticized OneWisconsinNow?<br /><br />Implausible? What sort of evidence would convince you?Display Namehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15842340986220388709noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-54383529360094012402011-12-15T18:19:08.925-06:002011-12-15T18:19:08.925-06:00Short version: Ideological/partisan hacks don'...Short version: Ideological/partisan hacks don't like being called out.<br /><br />No duh. <br /><br />It always amuses me when the two sides fight over who lies/distorts/<br />fantasizes/deludes more or worse.<br /><br />Talk about delusion: you people actually think you have the high road. No wonder getting called out on your b.s. is tough to deal with.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-56566296737185746882011-12-15T15:54:36.123-06:002011-12-15T15:54:36.123-06:00It is possible that Republicans lie more than Demo...It is possible that Republicans lie more than Democrats. It is also implausible.Rick Esenberghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07280070509167910367noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-974362292080959552011-12-15T14:46:03.416-06:002011-12-15T14:46:03.416-06:00That darn so-called "reality"! It always...That darn so-called "reality"! It always seems to have a bias against Republicans.Display Namehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15842340986220388709noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-39348513071260940172011-12-15T13:07:55.998-06:002011-12-15T13:07:55.998-06:00a University of Minnesota study that provides over...<b>a University of Minnesota study that provides overwhelming evidence that PolitiFact has a pro-Democratic bias</b><br /><br />Dead on except for the above. Ostermeier's study does not provide overwhelming evidence of PolitiFact's pro-Democratic bias. It provides a strong evidence of selection bias (which could harm Republicans more without being specifically ideological), but Ostermeier was correct in stating that it is <i>possible</i> that Republicans simply lie more. His point was that it's reasonable to presume a selection bias unless PolitiFact does something to control for it (don't hold your breath). <br /><br />Your take on the comparison between ending Medicare and ending Welfare was pretty much perfect.<br /><br />"Anonymous" wrote:<br /><br /><b>The one 'con' to that; they do not publish, in entirety, their own interviews cited as sources pertaining to their 'ratings.'</b><br /><br />I certainly don't agree that's the only "con," but you make a great point. PolitiFact Texas has, on occasion, posted portions of email interviews. It's not in a particularly clear format, but it's something (look up "Pete Sepp").Bryan Whitehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07608604859044029293noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-20692053.post-31167508307574509912011-12-15T12:35:46.125-06:002011-12-15T12:35:46.125-06:00I agree.
I find their ratings to be quite incon...I agree. <br /><br />I find their ratings to be quite inconsistent.<br />Politifact's ratings are based on their 'picking apart' statements, rating each 'part', and averaging the sum of those individual ratings to arrive at a final rating as a whole.<br /><br />In my opinion, a statement is an individual statement. Rate the statement 'as stated!'<br /><br />I do appreciate that Politifact cites their sources. One can refer to those sources to arrive at one's own 'rating'.<br /><br />The one 'con' to that; they do not publish, in entirety, their own interviews cited as sources pertaining to their 'ratings.'Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com