Tuesday, November 20, 2007

Can't we all just get along?

What are we supposed to make of the spoof of the COEXIST bumper stickler by Tom McMahon?

To review the bidding, here's Tom's parody:






of the original bumper sticker:






Local blogger Anne Quimby Mathias has criticized the parody. Marcus White of the Interfaith Conference wrote to WTMJ demanding that the parody be removed from TMJ's website.


That bumper sticker will never adorn my Mini Cooper. It's not that I advocate religious war or don't think that we ought to be able to get along with folks of different world views. But appropriating the symbols of these traditions and assembling them into a command that is probably most often expressed by people who do not follow (or follow loosely) any of them strikes me as patronizing. Since, as the reaction to Tom's parody demonstrates, the bumper sticker is not directed at Islam (the one that actually has a significant contingent that opposes the idea of a coexistence), the implication is that whatever the distinctives of your faith tradition, keep themselves to yourself and buy into the notion that all faiths are equally valid or invalid.

I recognize that reaction takes a bit of social context and some assumptions about who is expressing the "coexist" message. Maybe I am reading too much into it. But the reaction to the parody seems to bolster my point.

One criticism is that, to make the parody work, he had to replace the Star of David with a swastika. Marcus White argues that this is "distasteful", "ignorant" and "always offensive." This would be the case if the message was some equivalence between Nazis and Jews. But Mr. White has to know that this in not what McMahon intended or what any reasonable person would think he intended. He needed an "x," for Siva's sake, The notion that this is "always offensive" is either intentionally obtuse or reflects a medieval belief that symbols have innate powers apart from the message they convey. It's as if the totem has been defiled and the gods will respond in wrath.

The other criticism reflects what I think is a larger problem with the bumper sticker. Marcus White writes that by publishing the parody on his website, Charlie Sykes "seems to be endorsing the notion that terrorism can be blamed on Islam as a faith. I am sure that Mr. Sykes is well-aware that Muslim leaders in Milwaukee and throughout the world have repeatedly condemned the terrorists."

I am aware of that. I am aware that many people do not interpret Islam to command violent jihad against unbelievers and those who are thought to have offended Allah. I am aware that many Muslims do not interpret their faith to require treating women like filth. It is my impression that, within the United States (but perhaps not the world), these Muslims are an overwhelming majority of adherents to Islam. It is because of these faithful and peaceful Muslims that we ought to be careful to limit our criticisms to those factions within Islam who do, with apologies to Mr. White, believe that their faith commands murder and misogyny.

But those factions exist and they are rather large. Islam has a problem and it will still be there whether or not we pretend that it isn't. As the left correctly points out, terrorism is not a cause, it's a tactic. I wish the enemy wasn't an ugly version of Islam adhered to by millions of people. But it is. I don't see how you respond to a problem by deliberately misunderstanding it. By positing an equivalence among faiths on the question of coexistence, the bumper sticker does that.

One final point. Marcus White's belief that coexistence requires that TMJ take down the parody actually reflects what has made coexistence with Islam in Europe so difficult. Coexistence in a diverse society requires understanding that other people who do not share your views will say and do things that offend you and you do not get to make them stop.

54 comments:

JesusIsJustAlrightWithMe said...

Good points. What I find most interesting about this whole coexisting thing is that so many people read McMahon's parody bu,per sticker as a comparison between Naziism/Communism and Islam. I read it as a comparison between Naziism/Communism and Islam/Christianity/Judaism/Hippies/Gays/women/men. If you look at history, you could have made the same point by replacing those letters with Mongol symbols or Egyption symbols, or even more Christian symbols.

The idea of coexisting is great, but it totally falls apart when just one group decides not to coexist. Which group that is isn't all that important. A few of the conservative bloggers made comments like "try coexisting with the Nazis." But that misses the big (though totally unrealistic and naive picture). Coexisting with the Nazis would have worked out just fine if they had also tried to coexist with the Jews/Poles/Brits etc. Obviously that thought is ridiculous in the real world, but the point is that coexisting would be great IF EVERYONE agreed to it. That's just such a huge "if" that it makes the idea come off as pretty laughable. Still, "you may say that I'm a dreamer..." and all that.

Dad29 said...

Until there's an agreed-upon Natural Law foundation, there will not be "co-existence" except as we have it today, which is directly analogous to the 'co-existence' of the Earth's tectonic plates.

Mostly calm and peaceful--but then, suddenly, a huge and violent several moments wreaking unimaginable destruction on all parties, innocent and not-so-innocent.

Anonymous said...

How does anyone "have to know" that it's okay to replace the Star of David with a swastika?

It's not okay anywhere I've been. Is it okay to replace all those crosses in your campus classrooms with swastikas? And we all would "have to know" that it's okay? That it wouldn't bring to mind Jesuits' treatments of Jews. . . ?

Would it "have" to be okay if the satire had replaced the cross with the swastika? Just another "blip," as they say these days, hmmmmm?

3rd way said...

The coexist bumper sticker, like most bumper stickers, is pretty stupid. A good point can't be made in a simple statement. The parody sticker is an even cruder attemept at making a point. The statement McMahon was trying to make is valid, but he should stick with words. The equations he makes by substituting symbols ends up lumping an entire faith with murderous sects. It is dumb and not worth all of this debate.

The interfaith conference is right in suggesting that the largest media conglomerate in the state remove such tripe from its website. Independent bloggers are free to publish whatever foolishness they want, but someone with a pulpit as powerful as Mr. Syke's should see that he has a responsibility to the common good and refrain from rhetoric that fuels bigotry.

JesusIsJustAlrightWithMe said...

"Until there's an agreed-upon Natural Law foundation, there will not be "co-existence"..."

Are you saying Hitler was right? *shiver*

Anonymous said...

Coexistence is impossible because people who gain power always abuse those who are not in power. One of human natures worse attributes.

Conservatives have known this for years and have always distrusted people in power until recently.

Our form of goverment came from the Christian religion where the members voted for there pastor and they thought it would be best for our civil goverment to prevent power from falling into the wrong hands.

Our goverment now only represents the 1% aethiest population of this country. So much for representative goverment and coexistence.

JesusIsJustAlrightWithMe said...

"Our form of goverment came from the Christian religion where the members voted for there pastor and they thought it would be best for our civil goverment to prevent power from falling into the wrong hands."

Are you suggesting Christians invented democracy? Cause, like, Plato talked about democracy way before Jesus was even invented. Ya know what, I'm not even going to pick this apart. It's just so idiotic I can barely take it. I mean, do you really think Christians even practice democracy? Our particular form of democracy was created by a group that included a few true Christians, but mostly diests, unitarians and "wink wink, nudge nudge Christians." It's true that they got some ideas from Christianity, but they got a lot more from the Greeks and John Locke and shit like that. I mean, C'MON, why do you guys have to keep perpetuating this LIE?!?!

Rick,
Perhaps you would be kind enough to explain to this anonymous commenter that, at the very least, Democracy's roots do not rest in Christianity?

Anonymous said...

jisjawm -

Did you know that the Pilgrims first form of goverment was communism?

It was after that failed to produce the substance needed that they decided to give everyone there own land to produce crops. That worked.

It was when the Pilgrims came to this country and realized that they now are the goverment and wrote something called the "Mayflower Compact". Sound familiar?

From there constitutions were wrote and finally the US constitution was wrote.

So quit being such a moron and read history or listen to those who have and you would know that your equation of the populace is out in some never, never land with you.

Happy Thanksgiving.

JesusIsJustAlrightWithMe said...

Oh I'm sorry. I thought the Mayflower sailed after Plato lived.

Rick Esenberg said...

JesusIsJust

I don't think that you would like everything I have to say about this. I do not think that democracy is necessarily rooted in Christianity. In fact, the French thought they were in irreconcileable conflict and de Toqueville was quite taken with the fact that America was both religious and democratic.

The founders assumed, rather than established, a Christian nation. Locke thought that religion (a certain form of Christianity) was essential to liberal democracy because he couldn't conceive of an irreligious populace possessing the required virtues. In fact, I just read an interesting paper suggesting that a Lockean view of democracy may very well require that jihadist Islam be accorded fewer rights. I am not saying that I agree with that but the story is more interesting than the dichotomy between a Deist/secularist and devout Christian founding.

And, of course, many people argue that you have to look at the understandings present during the post-Civil War era in which the 14th Amendment (which came to incorporate most of the the Bill of Rights and apply them against the state) was adopted.

JesusIsJustAlrightWithMe said...

"I do not think that democracy is necessarily rooted in Christianity."

Thanks. You know, we may diagree about what the founders thought about the relationship between church and state and all, and that's fine. But I get the impression that you have a more well thought out analysis than many of your commentors on that topic. You, a person they trust and believe, would be doing them a service if you would call out the lies they tell, even if they are in support of a position you are sympathetic too. You know which quotes of the founders were David Barton lies, right? You know the context in which Jefferson made his bible and all that, right? Why not help some of these people get the correct understanding?

Anonymous said...

jisjawm -

oh yes - I can see all the Pilgrims huddled around the camp fire reading Plato and saying that he has some good ideas, lets try that.

Do you really think that is what happened?

Catholics were not even given the right to serve in goverment until after the revoltion. You want us to believe that there were diests and athiest serving in the colonies?

I don't think so...but good try.

Dad29 said...

JIJAWM, 'natural law' theory RIGHTLY UNDERSTOOD.

There are enough "You're Hitler" people running around the 'net without you joining them.

Christianity (the original one--Catholicism) is a monarchy, of course, with Christ as King. But since He left, Catholicism first favored a monarchical system (benevolent monarchs, please...) and only slowly acknowledged the benefits of 'democracy,' albeit rather cautiously. The strongest advocate of 'democracy' was very recent--a U S Catholic priest.

The problem with 'democracy' is the tendency to supplant Right Order with Majority Rule as the norm. Warren's SCOTUS underlined the challenges, and of course, Roe was a capstone.

And contrary to current trends in governance in the USA, the Church holds that 'subsidiarity' is the first principle--that is, problems and policies should be resolved and set by the lowest-possible level of Gummint--not the National one.

Locke's (and G Washington's) thesis--that only well-formed, highly moral people could "keep" democracy--is dead-on.

On the other hand, I do not know if "democracy" is espoused by or compatible with Judaism. (That's not a negative question--that's an open one.)

Islam is NOT. Buddhism and Confucianism haven't tried--I don't think they really care.

Dad29 said...

That priest, by the way, was John Courtney Murray. Hard-line conservative Catholics still blanch at the name.

Anonymous said...

Catholicism was not what intervened between Plato and the Pilgrims that inspired the Mayflower Compact.

It was the Magna Carta.

And it had some roots in Christianity -- but in the Protestant rebellion against Catholicism, and it really was a parallel secular rise of classic libertarian thought owing as much or more to Gutenberg as to Luther.

Anonymous said...

Sorry, dropped a word: ought to be classic libertarian democratic thought, based in the premise that if given access to sufficient good sources of information, we eagerly will avail ourselves of same so as to be capable of self-governance (rather than governance by Divine right, i.e., a premise rooted in secularism rather than religions).

As for what Gutenberg would think of what he wrought, in terms of bumper stickers . . . well, his innovation was followed by more popular publications such as calendars and cookbooks than by Bibles. But bumper stickers? Beyond even his ken then, I bet.

Dad29 said...

Anony 6:50...huhh?

The Magna Carta was executed LONG before the rebellion of Luther, which was before the rebellion of Henry VIII.

The Pilgrims were an offshoot Protestant branch which was intensely disliked by the English monarchs (Anglican) AND the Catholics.

They returned the favor in Elizabethan England, raising hell for Catholics and Anglicans alike.

The Magna Carta was put in place by a rebellion led by Catholics, against a Catholic (a jerk, nonetheless.)

Anonymous said...

I think it would be more accurate to say that it was the publication of the English version of the Bible that moved people to self governance.

When King James broke away from Catholicism he thought giving people the Bible in there languauge to read would help establish his authority over his church of England. He didn't anticipate the rise of the puritans in there attempts to purify the king.

This moved the people to America where they believed they were establishing a new nation for Christ, not the King, Pope or anyone else. Many protestant followed and each colonies constitution testifies to this.

Protestant toleration was rooted deep in there desire for evangelism, hoping that others would convert to Christianity. However, they did not want one denomination to rule over the other, which is why we have the Federal goverment that we do. It was set up to debate those things that all denominations could or could not agree upon. It was never intended to throw Christianity out of public life. That is the intolerance of the aethiest that do not wish to coexist with anyone.

Take a look at communism and the 100 million+ plus people they killed of there own, which manifest the intolerance of there beliefs.

JesusIsJustAlrightWithMe said...

"JIJAWM, 'natural law' theory RIGHTLY UNDERSTOOD."

You mean as told to us by the Flying Spaghetti Monster?

Actually, I kind of dig "natural law" theory in some ways even though I'm totally aware of its many shortcomings (overall, I'd take Dworkin over Aquinas any day). But I often not that some US laws, like our immigration policy or our drug laws, are "unjust laws."

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